A2 milk

[jamshundred]

Received yet another phone call from a member of the Amish community in PA last evening looking for an A2 producing cow.  It seems the Amish in this region that are calling and purchasing cows from me have an intolerance for the A1 beta casein, and when they and their children drink the A2 milk they have no problems.  I bring this up because I have heard case after case of folks who have benefited from the milk that has been tested and confirmed A2 and yet. . . . for months I had been hearing that certain members of the "establishment" wanted to disprove A2 milk.  Oh well.   Then I began to see an increase in questions and negativity regarding the science and testing of A2 and started to wonder if there wasn't a concerted effort behind the scenes.  And then the Bulletin arrived and I see that ADCA has commissioned Dr. Gus Cothran to disprove the A2 science.  Really?  Is he going to visit those third world countries where the animals are all naturally A2 by nature. . . . .  where the science and research began?  Why is it so important to disparage something that is good?  I've never heard a single person say they faired better on the A1 beta casein versus the A2?   And if nature gave us A2. . . . and A1 is the mutant dog in the soup. . . . . why is it important to the leadership of ADCA and Dr. Cothran to put A2 out of business?  For instance, there seems to be animosity because A2, who owns the patent receives income from their research and investment.  Hmmm.  Lots of negative comments about that.   I wonder if they realize that Dr. Beever had a patent on the PHA test and received income from the laboratories using his patented test?   ( As well as a number of other patents for testing in other breeds).    Same for the chondrodysplasia test which required licensing from Australia.   Do they not realize that many of the tests they have performed on their dogs and cats are patented and the scientists receive payment on those patents?  A search of the internet will turn up patents for which Dr. Cothran and/or his laboratory associates held patents.   I am curious why members of this breed are being given the opinion that the patent income received by A2 Corporation is something to villify.

Judy

[wvdexters]

Coming from a family that has issues with milk, this has always been a subject I am particularly interested in.

My question: ADCA has commissioned Dr. Gus Cothran to disprove the A2 science?

Is this something WE as members of the ADCA are paying for?? I surely hope not. We are a small assoc, with limited funds; and this is definitely not a DEXTER breed issue. My Opinion, let the big dairy breeds get into it. Large associations, large pocketbooks. This would be a waste of our limited resources that could be used to help the breed and our membership in so many other ways.

[lakeportfarms]

They are doing that WVdexters? What in the world is the motivation for that? Dexter owners are probably the biggest advocates of A2 milk out there. Or is there concern that there is going to be single trait selection for breeding animals, especially bulls? Gee, I think Pandora's box was opened on that some time ago starting around 1994...and has gotten out of control now.

I just wrote a letter to the ADCA President about the Region 3 director's comments in the latest Dexter Bulletin, not so much about A2, but about chondrodysplasia. To quote: “Our Dexters have benefited in that testing for two serious breed problems, pulmonary hypoplasia with anasarca (PHA) and chondrodysplasia (CD), now enables us to circumvent and eventually, one hopes, breed these death-dealing defects out of our cattle”.


Speak for yourself, not the ADCA as a regional representative. It had no business being in the ADCA bulletin.

[Donlin Dexters]

A2 marketing strategies are starting to equal that of low-fat food and weight-loss.
Cigarettes and cancer. How many studies were there with results either way for how many decades?

I dont understand it. People are complaining left right and centre in Australia about low weight prices and how the bottom has fallen out of the market and in the same breath they will disregard and ignore free-marketing re A2.

A house cow is a long-term commitment and even if people arent really sure about A2 health benefits, they still want what 'could be best' and they are prepared to pay a premium price just to be sure.

And how is breeding for a single trait any different to breeding Polled?

I recently read the selective breeding for longer teats in their females to make hand milking easier..........so how many good-quality but short teated Dexters will end up in the freezer?

My hubby knows the benefits of A2 first-hand - he has gone back to enjoying cereal swimming in milk for breakfast.

Someone only has to know of one person who benefited from changing to A2 and they will be sold regardless of studies stating otherwise.

[Donlin Dexters]

QUOTE FROM LAKEPORTS:
I just wrote a letter to the ADCA President about the Region 3 director's comments in the latest Dexter Bulletin, not so much about A2, but about chondrodysplasia. To quote: “Our Dexters have benefited in that testing for two serious breed problems, pulmonary hypoplasia with anasarca (PHA) and chondrodysplasia (CD), now enables us to circumvent and eventually, one hopes, breed these death-dealing defects out of our cattle”.
END QUOTE:

I am becoming less tolerant and less polite to those who practice chondrodysplasia fear mongering.

Would love to know the response from your letter Lakeportfarms

[wvdexters]

Soooo Lakeport. You saw that too. That one has been on my mind since I read it a few days ago. I was already planning to contact my regional rep but I think I'll be joining you in writing to the ADCA president too. These shots have to stop. It is bad enough on the forums but is unacceptable in the bulletin by a regional representative.

I did check to see if she was a member of the new Educational Committee. Thank goodness she is not.

[wvdexters]

Can't help myself; But did you notice that this time it's a "death dealing defect". WOW

[lakeportfarms]

Well said WV.   Knowing your writing style from the various posts on the other site it will be a good letter! Yes, the entire message was awful, but the "death dealing defect" was way over the line. I guess they've gotten tired of "lethal gene" and it wasn't working well enough for them even though it is the "scientific term", their most common excuse for using it anyway.

Good one about the education committee...lol In any case, in my mind a statement made by a regional representative that is offensive to any member not just in that particular region, especially when it violates the code of ethics, needs to go to one of the officers. I thought about Roberta Wieringa, who has a pretty large herd of chondro carriers herself, but decided to go right to the President.  Keep in mind the bulletin will also go online at some point and available to anybody who wants to slog through it, so it is there in perpetuity unless there is a retraction or apology with clarification made.  That should be the least effort made to mitigate what was published.  Perhaps we should all ask to compose an article for the next bulletin extolling the virtues (and there are many) of the chondro carrier Dexter?  I nominate you and Gene and Judy 

Code of Ethics:

G. So act in my breeding practice and in dealings with others as to protect and improve the good standing and reputation of the breed and of the Association.
H. Conduct myself in such a way as to protect the good order, welfare, reputation, and credit of the Association – abiding by the Bylaws and Standard Operating Procedures of the American Dexter Cattle Association – and doing no harm to the Association, its Officers and Board of Directors, or its membership.

I have somewhere around 35 chondro carriers, and many more cooking in the belly of our NON-CARRIER cows, which have NO chance of being bulldog calves. How is a statement like "death dealing defect" which is not just misleading, but untrue, on official ADCA correspondence, not "harming the membership"?  Am I not a member now?  Doesn't a statement like that by a representative of the ADCA, if taken as fact by another prospective (or current) Dexter owner that may be considering one of my animals to purchase make a sale less likely or result in considerably more effort on my part to convince them otherwise?  After all, I'm just a lowly member, and a statement like that coming from a regional representative MUST hold more weight in their mind, right?  Why, I must be hiding something!  What else am I hiding?  Sorry, I'll just go on to one of those herds who don't have those defects...

[wvdexters]

Exactly Hans. My herd is small but we are building it around the chondro carriers. The "shorties" to me represent the best qualities of the Dexter breed. Their size, temperament, and ability to not simply survive but to thrive in tough conditions is so unique and remarkable. I believe they are the heart of the breed. The foundation it was built on.  Its identity.

The misinformation and down right attacks that we are experiencing now is definitely hurting. Prospective buyers and those interested in getting into the breed see this stuff and are scared off before they ever get to a farm.   And now it's not only the anti-chondro breeders but a Regional Rep. too; and it's published by the ADCA itself.  This is our association.  I often wonder what the Founding Breeders, the celebrated ones they always like to discuss and admire would think if they were to wake up and see the Dexter Herd as it is today.  I wonder if they would even recognize it much less be pleased with it.

I am encouraged though with all of the action being stirred up on the Dexter pages on the internet. People are talking about their shorties and posting pictures of them with pride.   There is a growing interest in the old Dexters, so unlike what is being pushed today.    

They forget too quickly that we are also members. With the Code of Ethics on our side. They forget that Dexters come in two body types.  Always Have; Always Will.



 

[genebo]

The ADCA erred in not exercising control over what they printed in the Bulletin, just because it came from a Regional Director.

I will write my own letter to the president about the content of the article.

It was sooo far off base. I dread the effect it could have on members who have not bothered to read up on the subjects covered and accept this as fact, just because it made it into the Bulletin.

[lonecowhand]

Rightey-oh, WV and Hans. So pardon my ignorance, but how did these guys get to be the Official dexter association? Can that be overturned, upended, or undone? I am unclear as to the claim to authority , other than that they proclaimed it. I am going to ask this as a separate thread as soon as I figure out how to...

[lakeportfarms]

Sept 4, 2014 17:23:09 GMT lonecowhand said:

Rightey-oh, WV and Hans. So pardon my ignorance, but how did these guys get to be the Official dexter association? Can that be overturned, upended, or undone? I am unclear as to the claim to authority , other than that they proclaimed it. I am going to ask this as a separate thread as soon as I figure out how to...

Pretty much anybody could start an "official" Dexter association, the key is to get the membership and the momentum behind it through membership.  In order to do that you'd need seed money, and probably credibility with some pretty significant names in the Dexter world joining the association, thus helping it grow.  Not to mention excellent service to the members.

I am afraid that the ADCA is so fractured now it will never really blend the three or so main factions together.  The polled, the traditional, and the chondro breeders seem to have different opinions on the direction of the breed.  The traditional and chondro breeders have the most in common, and could exist fairly peacefully, however the chondro vs. polled, and traditional vs. polled don't seem to be able to get along.  If there is to be any harmony, I think that the ADCA will ultimately need to designate sub groups under the Dexter label, much like Judy has done with Legacy along with an explanation presented as to why there are these different classes.  Putting the polled in one group, and the horned in another group.  Forget about Lucifer, etc...there will never be a division based on that through the ADCA, that is strictly Judy's domain.  Chondro could fall in either group of course, but I'm sure would be most represented in the horned group.  The problem then comes with representation on the board, regional representatives, etc...insuring a fair treatment of all of the "sub-groups" by the officers/leaders.

Anyway, sorry to be off topic, I'll refrain from any further comments unless a new thread is formed.

[jamshundred]

I'm going to move back to A2 milk again.  Will comment on other things in the thread elsewhere.

For a year or so the inner circle of ADCA has been fretting about A2 milk.  From the first I heard of it. . . . . I was perplexed.   A2 milk. . . IS. . . what one would call the milk of nature.   This is one of my criticisms of "political" groups.   They seem to rapidly adopt a "pack" mentality. .. .and the ability to reason on the level I've always known as " with common sense" dissipates.

If A2 milk is what bovines produced in the beginning . . . .

So, as the naysayers. . . said. . . . .  I shrugged.  My philosophy then and now is. . . . . what harm can there be in drinking what nature provided from the beginning?  It seemed to me there was enouogh anecdotal evidence in the early research and ongoing research to tell me I didn't want to drink A1 milk but let others do what they chose.  No one was outlawing it!  Nor attempting to.  And in both the countries of Australia and New Zealand. . .  .the most powerful dairy interests in the world have already attempted to sully the science and the company apparently without success.  

Gene Bowen first discovered A2 milk a number of years ago. . . and he also was the first person to test a Dexter cow for A2 milk.  The pioneer of A2 in the Dexter world.  He is directly responsible for events which eventually led to the A2 test being available to all cattle owners in America.  Perhaps it is the personalities and not the science that had the knickers in knots.   The argument that people are selecting for a single genetic trait is disengenuous when most of the leadership has been breeding polled bloodlines now for a decade or more

But. .  . as usual we can find the ADCA personnel happily having their tail wagged by the dog.  Does anyone find it as ludicrous as I that ADCA has a horse expert tryng to disprove A2 company science and accomplish what heavily resourced and financed dairy interests could not?   Science that began long before there was an A2 company?  Do they really have nothing better to do for their membership than this?  And please. . . . since I've watched them diligently working to decimate a wonderful dwarf  breed of cattle for years now. . . . . there isn't a soul living that would have any success trying to convince me it IS for the breed.  HA!   So .. .. .. who and what is behind this is the question. Why do they care so much?

Meanwhile there is science from Ireland. . . ( if one calls this work science.   .because it seemed like the walk-on character in the screenplay to me - just not very deep in actual substance) which is published in the Irish Journal of Agricultural and Food Research, Vol. 47, NO.1, 2008 which does NOT disprove the A2 company science. . .  . ) which recently has been linked for Dexter owners though I am not sure the purpose since this is SIX years old. . . there is a recent  study that shows negative reactions with A1 milk that has been poo-pooed because it was financed by A2 corp yet one needs to read the actual article and comments from the researchers to note it did not effect the research, ( I wonder WHO is going to pay for the research to substantiate their position if they don't- more lack of common sense IMO) and just recently China has approved an A2 milk formula for babies for import.   So, in all the world. .   ADCA's horse expert is the go-to guy to bring down A2?  And they wonder why some of us cluck


.irish Journal of AG-Vol 47 No1..html (159.18 KB)



thea2milkcompany.com/first-human-digestion-trial-on-milk-proteins-shows-there-is-a-difference-2-2/

www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/agribusiness/10294507/China-approves-a2-Milk-Company-product

Judy