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Post by lakeportfarms on Feb 3, 2015 21:08:35 GMT
I was thinking of this recently...one of our favorite posters likes to make the point about the Dexter breed being a compilation of a variety of breeds from the beginning, which is true. However he misses one important point in his argument.
Breeds such as the Jersey, Angus, and others in 1880-1890 or so do not resemble the Jersey, Angus, etc.. of today or even 20 years ago. Have a look at some of the historical photos of these breeds, and you'll find that many of them, in particular the Aberdeen Angus, were almost non-dwarf Dexter size many, many years ago. Years and years of selection and "genetic drift" has turned them into "supercows", with exceptional beef and milk production compared to their ancestors.
Therefore, the effect of introgression of these other breeds in recent years would have had a far greater impact and damage on the Dexter population in terms of phenotype than back when it was formed, or even prior to 20-30 years ago.
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Post by genebo on Feb 4, 2015 1:44:08 GMT
It's funny you should mention those breeds. A few years ago, I had an occasion to spend an evening with a man who had sent a lot of his life raising Jersey cattle. He was a close friend of Dr. Sponenburg, at VPI, and they had amassed a lot of records of Jersey cattle. He was known in some circles as "Mr. Jersey".
He wanted to tell me about Jerseys. He said he knew all about Dexters, because for a long time he had two herds, one of each. Like you said, at first the Jersey cattle were just about the same size as the taller Dexters. They were also horned. 100% of them were horned. He emphasized the point. It was to eliminate the horns that some owners started using polled bulls over their Jersey cows. Most of them used Angus, which were readily available.
That took the horns off, but it also introduced black coloring to the "Jerseys" that resulted. It also added size to the offspring. The cows got bigger as they lost their horns. At the time we talked, he told me he could identify at a glance a Jersey that had Angus blood, even if she had horns. He could tell by her coloration. He said that the black color persisted. He even blamed the Dexter for adding black color to the mini-Jerseys that were created by crossing a Jersey with a Dexter. He said that when it began being popular to make a mini Jersey using a Dexter bull, it made him so mad he sold his entire herd of Dexters.
Isn't it odd that someone on the other side of cross-breeding can be as mad at us as we are at those who cross-breed our Dexters? Stop to think: the exact same calf that a Jersey owner calls a mini Jersey can be called a Dexter by an unscrupulous Dexter owner.
The tag line of the evening's talk was who he sold his Dexter herd to. He said that a big car pulled up and a foreman got out to inspect the Dexters. They were deemed suitable, so the sale was arranged. He wanted to know who he was selling to, so he was taken to the car. When he leaned in, he saw Robbie Benson, the movie star. They spoke about the cattle for a few minutes, then the car drove off. A truck came and got the Dexters and his association with Dexters was over.
He tried to convince me to switch to Jerseys. He said he owned, and knew of more, some Jerseys that were just like they were when they came off the boat. Darling little old-time guinea, rabbit-eyed Jerseys (horns and all). The Jersey equivalent of Legacy Dexters. When I told him I would stay with my Dexters, he told me I was missing out, for surely I would never get a better offer from anyone.
He was welcome to think what he wanted, for there was something he failed to consider. He surely had never been threatened by a Dexter bull, bul equally surely he had been threatened by a Jersey bull. It may be true that a jersey cow can be just as gentle as a Dexter, but that's just 1/2 of the equation. Jersey bulls are the meanest of all breeds and kill more people every year than any other breed. I'm too chicken to want to take part in pasture poker every time I go in. I'm afraid I'd lose.
Believe me, I'm happy with my decision.
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Post by jamshundred on Feb 4, 2015 2:13:17 GMT
Hans,
Most first generation crosses I have seen with Dexters look like Dexters, especially if the Dexter is a carrier bull. It is the second generations where questions lurk about the outcrossing. Take a crossing with a small polled animal for instance. Let's say the calf has scurs and the owner dehorns it considering it a horned cow. The supposed Dexter is bred to another Dexter and what can you get? You can get a polled calf that parentage confirms to both parents and is now a "novel mutation".
Do you know there was once a breeder on the chat boards who purchased ( according to him) 100 Dexter females and he bred 50 as Dexters and the other 50 to Angus for beef animals. I never tracked down his story. . . but it was on DC2 way back in the beginning before the Yahoo boards crashed and all the early posts lost. I've always wondered how he managed those animals.
Judy
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